The question is, if something will break.
Right now we’re dealing with:
~ the war against Iran escalating ( Two blocked straits, ah…ah…ah…);
~the affordability crisis and oil-crisis level inflation. Half the country is going into debt affording rent food and fuel;
~ the corruption and self-dealing in Washington is out in the open
~ people can’t survive in their own homes thanks to data centers
~ ICE is killing people and abducting them by the thousands, and ignoring due process
~ Private prisons are torturing people by the tens of thousands, including kids and pregnant mothersI’m sure I’m missing some, but for the moment all this isn’t enough to stop at least half the US from wanting to own the libs and keep trans folk out of women’s sports. We haven’t suffered enough to hand the Democrats the Senate yet, which means Social Security is going to die, and the Trump administration will be able to push through SCOTUS justices.
This might be because MAGA has a technological advantage. FOX News has gotten really good at propaganda, so its (massive) viewership is continuously stoked with rage and fear, is pumped with MAGA ideology and is encouraged to stop watching all other media. The right-wing propaganda machine makes sure that every white male has to vote red to reaffirm their masculinity.
And then the ultra-wealthy are vastly richer than any other point in history. After they bleed the US to collapse, they will have the capacity go on to do the same with the rest of the industrialized world. The EU has already been weakened by decades of neoliberal policymaking and now has strong far-right factions. And those same billionaires are consumed by greed, vindictiveness and disgust with the entire working class.
So yeah, we’re going to have to get really lucky for the US not to collapse. The German Reich ran out of credit and was driven to get expansionist and annex other lands. The US is already lusting over Canada and Greenland, so it shouldn’t be surprising if the devaluation of the petrodollar leads to US military adventurism. And then our fighting force and oil reserves are already depleted.
So… Chinese bombers blotting out the sun over Washington.
Love Mamdani, but we can’t pretend the things he campaigned on and is accomplishing in NYC would work everywhere, especially battleground states. Not saying the move is to pivot to the center/right, but we have to be realistic…
They have to maintain this delusion around here. They refuse to believe that their preferred policies aren’t secretly loved by everyone.
FDR populism was supported by farmers. Just don’t push social policies and stick with economics.
You heard it here first, “fuck minorites, gay people, transgendered people etc.” is the new position of “progressives”.
The entrenched establishment that still controls the DNC aren’t interested in winning elections if it means offending AIPAC or their mega rich and corporate donors. They can’t offer any meaningful change for the working class without risking their own paychecks, so they don’t have any moves except “not Trump.”
Over 100 Democrats are voting against funding Israel now. Are they not in the DNC?
Oh wait, yeah they are.
Or, in reality, the progressive voters don’t show up during Democratic primaries and the DNC responds to those who do.
Progressives showed up to the primary for New York mayor and the DNC responded with Islamophobia, an anti-socialist manifesto, and threats of splitting the party.
the DNC responded with Islamophobia
Have a source on that?
https://www.huffpost.com/entry/top-democrat-racist-tirade-zohran-mamdani_n_6861aab5e4b08e0b4a741231
https://www.jezebel.com/democratic-leaders-join-republicans-islamophobic-attacks-on-zohran-mamdani
https://newrepublic.com/article/199293/democratic-establishment-shunning-mamdani-disqualifying
https://newrepublic.com/post/196734/andrew-cuomo-ad-edited-photo-zohran-mamdani
Hopefully a lot more to go. We even got a progressive who won the Democratic primary for Senate in Kentucky, Charles Booker. Though he hasn’t called himself a socialist, he’s running on the same social democratic platform as the DSA-aligned socialists have been.
We showed up for Bernie in droves that the DNC got so scared they conspired AGAINST him to prevent any chance of him being the nominee. I’m done with neo-liberals, they’re as much contemptible as reactionaries, more so because they pretend to be on our side.
they conspired AGAINST him
No, they didn’t. You just believe what you want to believe because the person you like didn’t win. Just like MAGA does. Good for you.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2016_Democratic_National_Committee_email_leak#Bernie_Sanders’s_campaign But hey, pretend you’re right like neo-liberals do.
Where’s the link where Bernie said he was cheated? Or maybe you can explain why Bernie advocated that everyone vote for the “evil neo-liberal” Harris? Funny how often THAT gets ignored.
Bernie lost BOTH times because he’s not as popular in real life as he is in your bubble. I don’t like that either but it’s reality and you continuing to drive this wedge in the party when Trump is destroying country is NOT was Bernie wants you to do. Unlike you cultists, he has integrity and believes in his causes. YOU do not care about his causes because you help put in office people who set them back by decades.
The link you provided in NO WAY proves that the DNC somehow cheated in all the states Bernie lost. You have to give up this delusional nonsense and face reality. Yes, you have proven that SOME individuals in the DNC preferred Clinton. Guess what? That happens in every single fucking primary. There were people in the DNC who liked Sanders more - but you just discount them altogether because you agree with them. There is NO proof in your link that shows that Sanders would’ve won if those DNC members who didn’t like him didn’t exist. There is definitely no proof that there was voter fraud.
Brad Marshall suggested getting a reporter to question Sanders about whether he believed in God. There is no evidence the proposal was actually carried out.
Mark Paustenbach proposed promoting a story that Sanders’s campaign was disorganized. The suggestion was rejected.
-Schultz’s insults were NOT public before or during the primary.
So several things that never happened and one that was unknown to the public is your apparent proof of nationwide election fraud. Did win Trump win in 2020 as well?
Clinton won approximately 2,205 pledged delegates to Sanders’s 1,846, about 54% to 46%. So superdelegates did not turn the tide in the election.
The lack of debates is also not proof in any way. He had six debates to make his case. He did his best. He lost.
The Bernie-supporter lawsuit was dismissed, so it was not determined if the case had any validity. Is merely bringing lawsuits enough to prove fraud? Because the Republicans tried that like 70 times in 2020 and lost every single on of them.
To be perfectly honest, what you’ve provided is even flimsier than what I expected. There is nothing even approaching solid enough evidence in here to claim he was cheated. You have evidence of bias among a few individuals, NONE of which had their bullshit acted upon. And that’s proof that Clinton didn’t win more elections? You want to pretend that it came down to ONE contest and the DNC cheated there? Her delegate total accumulated across dozens of states/primaries.
This is essentially the same as Trump’s electoral denial. The only difference is that Bernie actually has integrity and Trump does not. Bernie doesn’t claim to have been cheated, Bernie did NOT say to sit out the election in protest.
Every single “progressive” who did that either in 2016 or 2024 is a phoney cultist asshole. They want to pretend that they’re acting in solidarity with Bernie but what they have done is set back the issues Bernie cares about for decades, at least. They’ll be a stain on his legacy.
TLDR don’t fucking care. Coming out in bad faith elsewhere while sea lioning you deserve absolutely no consideration. I would have thought it apparent but has to be spelled out.
You’re tilting at windmills, no one accused the DNC of engaging in election fraud (that’s MAGA’s ballpark). The person you replied to said DNC leadership “conspired against” Bernie, which is broad enough to mean a lot of things, including that they coordinated messaging to manufacture controversy around his campaign (as was proven true by the leaked emails).
Are Americans going to pop a blood vessel in their eye if they don’t use abrivations for everything?
Wait ‘till you learn that GOP stands for Republican.
Grand Old Pedophile Party
aka: Greed Over People party
The entrenched establishment that still controls the [Democratic National Committee] [is not] interested in winning elections if it means offending [American Israel Public Affairs Committee] or their mega rich and corporate donors. They [can not] offer any meaningful change for the working class without risking their own paychecks, so they [do not] have any moves except “not Trump.”
The problem is that most people know these organizations by their abbreviations rather than the whole title
Holy shit AIPAC stands for that? No wonder about the last few years then
(yeah I’m not american, I also only knew these by their abbreviations)
They’ve been lobbying hard for like 30+ years afaik
They’ve successfully overthrown the government with bribes and blackmail, the upcoming military integration seals it.
This is why primaries exist if I’m not mistaken.
Excellent point. If the DNC was captured by AIPAC, then they wouldn’t have primaries, and would instead figure out some way to nominate a pro-Israel candidate undemocratically.
These people who bitch and moan online never vote in primaries or actually participate.
I can think of one
Spill the beans
C’mon guys…
This is the current DNC chair talking about how Mamdani is the future of the party, from over a year ago.
Before Mamdani had even won his general election.
Well, first, it was a brilliant campaign. And there’s a lot of lessons.
One is, he campaigned for something. And this is a critical piece. We can’t just be in a perpetual state of resisting Donald Trump. Of course, we have to resist Donald Trump. There’s no doubt about it for all the reasons we just talked about. But we also have to give people a sense of what we’re for, what the Democratic Party is fighting for, and what we would do if they put us back in power.
And that’s really critical. And I think that’s one of the lessons from Mamdani’s campaign, is that he focused on affordability. He focused on a message that was resonant with voters, and he campaigned for something, not against other people or against other things. He campaigned on a vision of how he was going to make New York City a better place to live.
I think that’s one of the lessons. The other lessons, of course, is the tactics he used to get his message out, both a very aggressive in-person campaigning, meeting voters where they’re at, and then also in those digital spaces, using very creative messaging to cut through the noise and to get to voters in an inexpensive but authentic way.
There’s a lot to learn from that campaign, and I’m excited to learn more.
It’s over a year since the person with total and complete control over not just the party but the billions the neoliberals had hoarded…
And there’s still ignorant ass memes about how “the party” hates Mamdani.
We can’t just be in a perpetual state of resisting Donald Trump. Of course, we have to resist Donald Trump.
Oh, is that what they’ve been doing? Could have fooled me.
Democrats have won two standoffs in the current Congress, twice Republicans backs down.
But people like you will willingly ignore that because it doesn’t fit your agenda.
Two entire ones! Out of how many?
Of course you INSTANTLY downplay it. We both know there is no number that you would find acceptable because you’re not being honest about this, you just want your specific “team” to win. Anything that doesn’t fit your pre-determined, confirmation bias-based narrative “doesn’t matter”.
They could do more if people voted for them, but since you deliberately deprived them of that ability, they can only do so much. So many fucking idiots in this country thought they were “encouraging” Democrats to do what they wanted by taking away their ability to do anything.
I did vote for them. I’ve voted for them every election I’ve been able to participate in. I’ve been rewarded with jack shit for my efforts. Biden didn’t root out the fascists when he had the chance and now we’re fucked.
Good for you, NOT ENOUGH people did. That’s why they’re in this situation. You’re mad at them for not doing the impossible because you personally voted for them. That is goddamn ridiculous. And now you’re spreading misinformation and downplaying what they’re trying to do in their limited capacity.
Biden didn’t root out the fascists when he had the chance and now we’re fucked.
What the fuck does that even mean? We’re fucked because a huge portion of likely Democratic voters either were stupid enough to believe Trump’s lies or stupid enough to think they can “punish” Democrats to get what they want.
Democrats beat Trump in 2020 and have won a number of lesser elections but we continue to lie about them “never winning”. We can see them doing exactly what we say we want them to do (hold out in standoffs) and then we criticize them “doing nothing”.
I’m not saying they’re perfect or I have no criticisms. I’m saying this simplistic, low-information one-size-fits-all criticism is largely inaccurate and deserves as much scrutiny as anything else.
I don’t think you understand what the DNC is…
Like, just for shits and giggles, tell me what you believe the DNC should be doing right now. And I’ll probably take the two minute to explain why that has nothing to do with the DNC as an organization.
What if we didn’t do that and instead you just shut the fuck up
Anger and no understanding, how surprising.
Then you wouldn’t understand how our political system works…
And people not understanding how our political system works, is why shit is so fucked right now…
So…
What if we didn’t do that and instead you just shut the fuck up
Shit will continue to get worse and more people will literally die.
Because of your willfully ignorance and need for anyone that helps you to care more about your feelings than correcting your defiencies
And everyone else gets to see that you value personal pride more than the literal lives of other humans.
Especially since you just saw this exchange and kept at the chance to show the class…
Also, rational people are likely to just block you, and will never even attempt to explain anything to you ever again.
Up to you if that’s a path you want to keep walking down with others.
tl;dr
Why would anyone care about the opinion of someone that can’t read more than two sentences?
This is Lemmy, the truth is as anathema here as it is in MAGA circles.
I’ve noticed there’s a significant delay…
Browse by /new and it’s pretty decent
However there seems to be a lot of accounts that show in threads days later to try and pick fights.
Those accounts almost never seem interested in understanding. They’re just running around trying to start as many arguments as they can hoping someone bites
I’m not here often enough to have observed that. I am here often enough to see a lot of misleading comments pushing a predictable narrative.
Because the Democratic Party serves the same masters as the GOP. They exist toakensure that a large enough majority maintains faith in the system to keep the populace from revolting. They serve a secondary purpose of capturing and neutering any social movements that might create a danger to the Wall St agenda.
Note that “governing” and “policy” are not part of their purpose.
Hurr Durr BoTh SiDes’
Fucking idiots in here desperate to pretend this utter bullshit, even with all we’ve seen.
Masters = voters?
Lol, what action taken by either party in the last thirty years gave you the impression either of them serve their voters?
Most of them? You can keep pretending otherwise, but they are where they are because people voted for them.
Because the centrists care about money, that’s why they aren’t doing the obvious.
Ah but they don’t actually care if we are happy. They want the illusion of working for us while making their donors happy - the people they really serve.
most of them wouldnt be electable if they were republicans anyways, thats why they have to be wolf in sheeps clothing. and AIPAC, the donors dont want someone too on the left.
Mamdani won in NYC. His experience cannot be directly applied to the entire country.
Governor of Virginia wouldn’t have won on Mamdani’s policies.
We really need to stop being such single-minded idiots.
Abigail Spanberger won a tight race against an overt fascist without endorsements from any of the most powerful political blocs in virginia, like the UMWA, USW, UAW, or CWA. she also ran virtually unopposed in the democratic primary. she is not an example of someone who won because of the value of centrist politics. she’s currently wildly unpopular for vetoing populist left wing bills from the long session (60 days) without providing input during the session about what she wanted. the next, and final session of this legislature is a short session (30 days) and none of the legislaters knew what she wants or needs to pass environmental protections, labor protections, or affordability measures as Virginia experiences a housing crisis.
so.
no.
this is not a good counter example to Mamdani, but instead a good example of exactly why no one trusts corporate dems or ex-CIA agents
Didn’t seem to have much issues trusting them in 2020.
Oh I forgot, we’re not supposed to acknowledge that because it doesn’t fit the narrative. I guess 83 million people is “no one”. The standard leftist excuse for a moderate winning is that “they didn’t win by enough”.
Anyone who thinks the NYC constituency is the same as the entire country is a delusional fucking moron. That’s a completely indefensible argument that has no basis in reality. It’s just stubborn hubris from people who think they can “punish” their way into geting what they want by actively harming the causes they pretend to care about.
Spanberger won a tight race.
- She beat Earle-Sears 57% to 42%. Arguing that this was a “tight race” is disingenuous.
She lacked endorsements from UMWA, USW, UAW or CWA:
- She was endorsed explicitly by the CWA. She was also supported explicitly by other unions: SEIU 32BJ, AFGE and LIUNA. The AFL-CIO didn’t endorse her but that certainly does not mean they preferred her opponent.
She ran virtually unopposed in the Democratic primary
- If she ran unopposed in the primary, why didn’t Progressives put up a challenger? Is it HER fault she ran unopposed?
She isn’t evidence of the value of centrist politics
- The primary was uncontested so among Democrats you really can’t justify this statement. She then went on to convincingly win VA, which is not a certain blue state. It seems pretty clear to any honest person that her policies combined with Trump backlash are why she won the race.
She’s currently wildly unpopular.
- Recent polling cannot possibly be interpreted as “wildly unpopular”. The worst has at 44% approving/47% disapproving.
She vetoed populist left-wing bills.
- Some argument here, granted, but it’s still misleading. Some of the vetoed measures were bipartisan, rather than “left wing”. The drug affordability bill passed the Senate 36–4 and House 95-4. She has also singed hundreds of positive bills, including regarding housing and the environment. Also brought the state back into the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative. Acting like all she has done is oppose progressive policies is misleading.
She provided no input, and legislators didn’t know what she wanted
- The Democrats who spoke out about not hearing opposition until the veto phase are your hated “centrists”, by the way. Seems your happy to listen to them here. Also, her policy staff worked with legislators throughout the session; she submitted approximately 180 amendments, many of which lawmakers accepted. Yes, there were communication issues here but NO it was some deliberate attempt to scuttle progressive policies.
The “session” shit is ridiculous to begin with. They only meet for 30 days on odd numbered years? That’s supposed to be enough time to go from introducing a bill to passing it? In any event, as stated above, the administration did chime in on the considered legislation over 100 times.
Why am I not surprised to see such a misleading comment from a supposed “leftist”? You contribute to this “post fact” bullshit just as much as the right does.
She ran virtually unopposed in the Democratic primary
If she ran unopposed in the primary, why didn’t Progressives put up a challenger? Is it HER fault she ran unopposed?
Spanberger didn’t run for Congress is 2024 because she intended to run for governor in 2025. The lack of other primary candidates is obvious evidence of a party clearing the path for their chosen candidate.
obvious evidence of a party clearing the path
No, that’s paranoid delusional bullshit based on nothing. That IS NOT “obvious” evidence that there was some official “clearing the path” the disincluded more Progressive options. The only thing it’s evidence of is that no Progressive candidate stood up and tried to run.
The misinformation is fucking ENDLESS with you guys. It’s like you don’t even remotely care if what you say is true or not.
This is literally Chuck Schumer loser propaganda, stop repeating it. All it took to get conservative Maine to abandon Republicans was to put a rustic white male face on dem soc policy (Turned out the rustic white male was a rapist, so let’s maybe be careful about future rustic white male selection). Talarico is wildly and authentically popular in Texas. Working class policy can win everywhere, so long as voters can see themselves in the candidate.
Removed by mod
This is literally Chuck Schumer loser propaganda
No, it’s reality. Don’t try to hit me with your dumbass boogeyman bullshit. My opinion doesn’t come from Schumer, it comes from understanding the the heavily democratic, urban constituency of NYC is NOT THE FUCKING SAME as everywhere else in the country. Only an absolute moron could possibly believe that.
Have you ever lived in NYC? It’s not an outlier for US politics in any manner. The immigrants trend conservative, as immigrants in the US often do. There are many entire neighborhoods that are deep red enclaves (Orthodox, conservative immigrant communities, cop / firefighter communities like City Island / Seaside / Staten Island). Multiple NYC mayors have been Republicans, one of them was RUDOLF FUCKING GIULIANI. It’s the beating heart of global capitalism. Mamdani came out of NYC’s most progressive / leftist region of northeast Brooklyn and western Queens and would have never been elected mayor if he hadn’t found a way to communicate working class values to the entire swath of US political identities.
You can repeat his success anywhere in the US if you combine his platform with a relatable local identity and a strong ground campaign. Sorry if that freaks you out, it really shouldn’t.
Sorry if that freaks you out, it really shouldn’t.
Or we can stop pretending that what works on the NYC constituency will work on the entire country. We can ALSO stop pretending that Mamdani is the only type of Democrat to win an election - which again, he did in a race the Democrat candidate was heavily favored to win. NYC electing a Republican mayor in the Trump era is ridiculous. It just would not happen.
Giuliana back then was NOT the Trump-era dingbat he became.
I’m so tired of this “one-size-fits-all” lazy bullshit. Democrats are generally friendlier to workers’ rights than Republicans, that’s really not arguable. Yet, these people are voting against their own interests. Which means Republicans are gaining ground with their culture war bullshit. That’s why Democrats have lost when they did because even if they do support collective bargaining, workers’ rights or higher minimum wage people STILL vote for Republicans because of their culture war nonsense.
The economy was undoubtedly better under Biden than it was under Trump and we STILL have to hear this bullshit that about Democrats are the “real” enemy.
What “freaks me out” is losing control on this country entirely, which you is what will happen if we continue to be inflexible dumbasses who demand absolute purity “or else”.
Who? Mamdani marched in the pride parade last month
No, I wasn’t talking to Mamdani on this message board. I was talking to the “progressive” who advocated we drop social issues and focus only on economic ones.
I never said anything about dropping social issues, you brought “giving up on social issues” as a separate complaint in your reply to me and I ignored it for being disingenuous bait. It’s still disingenuous bait, nobody in US politics fights for social issues harder than a dem soc, because social issues are inseparable from economic issues.
Who do you think would fight harder for social issue? Kamala Harris or AOC? Karen Bass or Zohran Mamdani? Haley Stevens or Abdul El-Sayed?
You’re full of shit if you think dem socs are weak on social issues.
Get money out of politics.
It’s not some eldritch knowledge.
Well, sort of. It’s a giant ball of stupid to think what works in NYC will automatically work in any of the flyover states. If you come to the South and tell people you’ll make their lives better, they’ll hate you for it on principle. I do not think running a socialist ticket in Tennessee or Texas or even Iowa and Utah is going to work. We might find that a one-size-fits-all approach doesn’t work, which is why the Republicans haven’t been doing that in the decades they’ve been dominating and stealing.
That’s true, but it’s also slightly too specific. The point is that the right social programs matter. Create them and you can get votes, if you do it right… Or, do whatever Hillary was trying to do, and get nothing.
conservatives have always been on WELFARE programs, but they dont see it that way, thats the problem.
Dems have to ditch their addiction to AIPAC and corpo money.
Otherwise their fucked.
Is real.
I would argue that Mamdani, AOC, Sanders, and any others who follow that same path are all parts of a different party that is simply forced to run on the Democrat ballot. Meanwhile the true Democrats and Republicans are two wings of the same Corprocrat party who is there to progress the interests of corporations and the only divide is on what to do with the ‘remaining’ population.
Almost like they’re controlled opposition
A lot of people seem to think that Democrat means left, it doesn’t. It means they are left of MAGA at this point. There is a whole lot of right left of MAGA. Why people assume that every Democrat is going to want the same thing is the crazy part to me.
A good example is Charlie Christ. He was a Republican. Won Florida governor as a Republican. Come 2022 Florida voters were so far right voting for Desantis Charlie Christ ran as a Democrat.
It isn’t because Christ was suddenly further left.
Had he won he wouldn’t have suddenly supported views like left leaning people… He would have been a conservative capitalist like he’s always been.
