Peace be with you, F-Droid Community. 🌹
As many probably know, Google will block Android starting 2027.
Here is my hope: Google has shot itself in the foot with this Darth Vader move, because many People who loves privacy will now switch to de-googled systems, because ( Since to my knowledge), the blockade won’t affect those systems.
So this is just my Openion and my HOPE.
What’s your take on this?
And I kindly say to all developers: Please don’t register in Google.
There are so many people using de-googled systems now, including myself. Please keep going for us, and four you too. Please
Best wishes from Germany 🌹
I have developer mode enabled on my phone to get around this but it does force you to wait 24 hours.
I think it impacts any system running Google play services, even if you’re on GrapheneOS. Is that everyone else’s understanding too?
You do not need to install Play services on Graphene. You can. You can also install MicroG, or you can skip both and use NextPush or ntfy.
Hey, honestly I don’t know much about GrapheneOS. I only know it’s available for Google Pixels. But you’re right. All Google-certified devices will be ‘locked down!’
I can’t find the post, but I recall the Graphene developers saying this would not affect GrapheneOS because of the way they have play implemented. Play services on GrapheneOS is sandboxed, it does not have permission to enforce this check.
But it will affect GraphenrOS users if less developers will make FOSS apps because its harder to distribute them
Agreed
Okay neat, thanks for the explanation
Not fully what you’re asking but this was posted on their official Reddit
Google has already had to change how they plan on implementing their blocking app installs from unregistered developers after a lot of backlash. “Sideloading” will still be possible, as we’ve all learned from recent news. The 24 hour wait does add some friction to the whole process, which is the point of course, but it’s far less bad than some people are trying to make it seem. 24 hours, then it’s over and the user is free to install apps as they please.
This “sideloading” restriction is not even the biggest problem right now. Play Integrity is worse and does affect us directly. The effects of Play Integrity are showing up in multiple places, like now apps can’t be installed via Play Store, maybe Aurora in the future, apps refuse to run, Play Integrity verdicts are worse if an app was installed via another source than Play Store, and Automatic Protection has Play Integrity features being added. It’s a far bigger problem. It causes enough friction for some users that they give up on GrapheneOS or other non-GMS OSes to go back to whatever stock OS they had before, one complete with Google apps with privileged access and awful privacy. This other issue just got a lot more attention, and I’m guessing because it’s easier for people to fully understand.
We have been in touch with EU regulators about Play Integrity and I hope that can continue in the future. Google isn’t going to change things because a small group of people are complaining. We need regulators to help with big issues. We need to find a way to make them understand what is happening. Play Integrity is a big example of them locking things down under the guise of “security.” Fixating on other smaller issues is, in my opinion, less effective and a waste of time and resources. The “sideloading” thing has enough attention and opponents to the change have had some success.
well for one, you don’t even need play services for all apps downloaded from the play store. and for another, even for the ones that do need it, play services run as an unprivileged sandboxed app, the same as any. so it can’t enforce anything google wants because it has zero control over anything.
I think you’re overestimating the de-Google community.
I’d be astonished if there was 10 million of us. Compared to a few Billion normies, we’re a rounding error in their accounting.A rounding error that many friends and family rely on for tech advice.
I actually got surprised how quick people around me reacted to remove/avoid the tracker before sharing url links for example.
This is anecdotal, but yeah. I once mentioned this google thing to my wife. She was due to change her phone and once I explained she was like “I’d like to have what you have” so she is now on a refurbished Pixel with Graphene.
I too coverted my wife to GOS and my son. I’ve been predicating the risks of surveilance for 6-7 years now. We are all happy people :-)
I’d be shocked if there was even 1 million people globally using fully de-googled phones tbh
I’d actually guess it’s roughly 1 million globally. ±20%
The nonprofit GrapheneOS Foundation was founded in Toronto, Ontario, Canada, by Daniel Micay, Dmytro Mukhomor, and Khalykbek Yelshibekov in March 2023. It received large contributions from donors such as Ethereum developer Vitalik Buterin and Twitter founder Jack Dorsey. As of April 2026, the operating system had approximately 400,000 active users.
obviously thats just graphene. i use e/os on my phone. not sure how many other distros there are…
LineageOS is a big one compatible with many devices.
Yes, I would think that LineageOS has more users than any other alternative.
and I’m willing to bet a signifcant part of the userbase installs GApps after installing LOS. or at least microG.
Most Graphene users are still using Google, but in sandboxed mode. Very few, myself among them, are willing to put up with the downsides of no GPS
Umm, I have GPS on my Goog-less main profile no problem. The other profile with Play (just banking, parking and employer-subvented lunch app) also does. So not accurate.
Wait you can have a profile with play for banking apps etc? Can you detail it a bit? What phone and system Do you use?
They meant Google Play Services, not the Global Positioning System (confusing, I know)
Other commenter beat me to it, but I meant Google Play Services, sorry for the confusion
Google still has all the opportunities to get a big “fuck you” instead of “line goes up”. Why? Because when they fuck up an app on someone’s phone that someone will have an option to switch away. Will everyone do it? No. But will enough people do it to send a wave of de-googling in motion? I hope so
It’s not always about “winning”. Sometimes it’s about what you do and what you become while doing it. Do I want to be able to influence google directly? Yes. Do I need to? No. I just need a big-enough community that shares my values, and it’s OK for me that there’s an even bigger community nearby that shares something else.
It’s important. We’re not doing an election.
Indeed. Users like us might think we are in larger amounts. But sadly enough we are the minority.
Same with Linux.
Cheer up! It’s not an election, you don’t need to “win” against the evil by convincing everyone. If there’s a big-enough group around you, or even digitally around you, that share your values and your preferences here – that might just be enough. Even if you’d be alone, you could appreciate what you’re doing simply because it’s right. And you’re far from being alone.
Yea true. Maybe it’s also a good thing to be the minority. It also has advantages like no IPO and stakeholders killing the products.
it’s the lack of awareness combined w the convenience of modern day bread & circuses that keep everyone ignorant.
It’s also a lack of technical understanding and willingness of understanding. Most non technical people just don’t care.
This is a good quote ✌️
Well, Chinese people have phones, and they don’t have Google either. Surely there is a way out of all this.
Is there a program or a way to tell what apps currently on ones phone will be affected by this?
other people are posting their experiences with degoogling on lemmy and that’s how i stay informed.
Is your OS stock with Google on it? Change that software to something without Google
Is there a program or a way to tell what apps currently on ones phone will be affected by this?
Hi.
As far as I know, there is no program with which you can check this.
But, I know that for example F-Droid apps on Google-certified devices will no longer be usable, because these apps are not registered in the Play Store. According to the KeepAndroidOpen page, this will no longer work.
I want to add: According to the Samsung Galaxy Store Seller Portal, apps that are already installed will remain usable, just without updates.
Hopes, that helped.
I believe you may mean Darth Vader.
Also, I think everyone who was worried about this might have moved to a different ROM that’s more privacy focused and that there may be some movement but it will show up as a blip for Google because most people don’t understand and don’t care.
I believe you may mean Darth Vader…
😅You’re right. Thanks for the correction!
You have a good point. I also know many of people who have no clue about this. I talked a lot about this but they dont care. Anyway for me, every setback, even if it’s just a brief blip for Google is a triumph. Of course , a longer triumph will be great, but yeah… that is just my openion. And thanks again, for the Darth Vader Correction 👍🏻
I decided on graphene awhile ago and run what Google apps I need in a sandbox for this reason among others. My hope is that my approach will protect me from their overreach but at this point we need more successful development and marketing of alternative OS’s built on things like Linux because normal every day people don’t care what operating system it is so long as it’s available in their price range and it works.
You make a good point. And its so true. I know a lot of people who also dont care about Google Problems.
I’m just familiar with /e/OS so far. I’ve disabled microG and don’t use a single Google app. But I can’t judge the people who using it. The problem is really the ecosystem. Many companies build on Google, which means they’re not independent. The End result is : There are no real alternatives. So people only know Google and nothing else
the open source community response to this is a joke. not prepared at all. we’re totally fucked.
Hey. I’m trying to see everything positively though. I know its sucks, and im angry too. But how secure can a Google-certified device be AGAINST GOOGLE anyway? I could only deactivate the systems, which is why I wanted to buy an /e/OS device. And the news from F-Droid that Google was going to pull this shit was the kick in the ass I needed to finally buy a Fairphone with /e/OS.
I think it is great that you are putting your energy into something that feels meaningful to you. But we also need to make sure that we don’t waste our energy on something that doesn’t burn us out.
The current message has low energy, which means that the energy doesn’t spread so easily. What we need is high energy which means that energy spreads easily.
We need a high energy message. A message that empowers the individuals, makes us dream, makes us want to contribute to the movement.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts so openly. Sorry my message came off as “low energy” to you. But to me, it still holds up logically. Google makes money mostly from ads and our data. The more people boycott their products, the less funding goes to things like Project Nimbus. De-googled setups, a phone, an app, a browser, give me hope. This isn’t just about privacy for me, it’s about human rights! And i hope ther will coming more Alternatives.
Again: Thanks for sharing your openion so openly.
what do you mean? what would you have the community do?
I’d expect us to be organized enough to be prepared for google removing our foundation. Instead all we’ve got is a countdown timer and a call to pressure a fucking evil company into “doing the right thing”.
it’s as if we are begging on our knees to extend our execution date. I don’t feel any motivation about putting my energy on the line for this weak ass energy.
To be fair, this has been an issue from the start, and barely anyone cared about it until now. To put into perspective, the whole PC environment has evolved to be open within its fundamentals - Standardised components, user servisable parts, and ability to control what OS is put on.
In the case of phones, propriatery is the norm. No standardized components nor freedom, just the fact that we are doomed from the start as a single corpo essentially owns your phone not the other way around.
If something where to change it would be separation of the manufacturer from the OS and the premise of a free bootloader. Of course this is what’s happening right now with google-free phones; of course, this should’ve been done sooner - but at least this will work as a catalyst for the future devices.
I tried to open up an issue (and did a PR) suggesting a developer strike as a tactic (IE open source devs adding their names to a list to promise to remove our apps from google play if developer ID goes through) on the KeepAndroidOpen repo.
The maintainers of that repo have been ignoring me to death since April. I was told by the maintainer that the project was “leaderless”, but in reality it seems they’re very opposed to a developer strike, otherwise my PR would’ve gotten more attention.
Developers don’t want to strike because a strike means no pay because we are not unionized. It’s hard to unionize when it’s easy to find a new job for people. Our leverage is just leaving. But publishing on specific platforms don’t have that option.
Is there a change to an app in Google TOCs that can get folk to get app from F-droid?
For example: “Free features for this app only available on play. New features and enhancements available (paid or) for free through f-droid.” Or if you cannot openly advertise in the app, “Visit our website to get enhanced features and updates” with clear documentation on how to install and permit f-droid and get app through there.
That way, big app devs can create moves to f-droid, normalising it and chipping away at googles power. The more apps, the more legimate f-droid seems to normies.
Ideally done as soon before switchover as possible. Even reach out to content creators.
It moves from protest, to protest and solution.
Must be a US based/themed online “protest”
“We want something to change”
“We aren’t going to do anything drastic for the change”
“Nothing changed? Oh well!”
They almost always seem like a controlled opposition set up to make people believe, gain support (artificially at first to deter competeting protests that are more radical), but once it gets popular it doesn’t accomplish anything, won’t listen to ideas, input and feedback from the community and fold as soon as they aren’t required.
I work on an Android app for a small company. Google doesn’t care at all about Android devs except if you’re running a huge social media app or P2W game. I’m pretty sure they expect blowback from the OSS community and their plan is to simply ignore it.
There are some really popular FOSS apps for android, that are also on google play. Things like tasks.org , all the fossify apps, termux, joplin, ankidroid, thunderbird / k9, and many more.
These being potentially removed from google play by developers due to a developer strike, would have more of an impact than KeepAndroidOpen’s current top strategy, which is for users to mass email their country’s regulators, which are easily ignored by either politicians or google.
If you or somebody will create this initiative, please create a post about it on Lemmy! (Or ping me here if you’ll remember.) It’s a good initiative! Worth the attention. I’d also be curious to know which developers have committed to the strike and which haven’t.
I don’t have the energy to start something and try to rally a bunch of devs, but I would join it.
We need a mobile Linus Torvalds, one that’s not Finnish-American.
Alas that’s not happening.
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He himself sprouted some fucked up lines in the episode of banning Russian devs from the LKML who could be resumed to “lol, cry me a river. I’m Finnish and you know what that means, right?”
And I guess you too?
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I know not everyone is like that. Sorry if it sounded that way.
But nobody can excuse Linus here.
Banning Russian devs was (is?) so performative, impractical and stupid, and of course lots of “apolitical” projects display Ukraine flag emojis, but you say one word about not liking genocide…
Exactly
I was doing Android development recently and apparently the official SDK builds needed to build the app aren’t FOSS, and actually FOSS versions are difficult to get. I still can’t wait until Linux phones are a thing, Android is such a shitshow nowadays and even GrapheneOS is still at the mercy of Google’s ecosystem. (also still no aarch64-linux support for the build tools either)
I’ll be serving as the tester for a de-googled phone, hopefully, next month for my family. If all works within expectations, we’ll be moving towards no google phone until the end of the year.
I’ll be getting a Murena phone.
That’s great to hear. Good luck! I wish I could de-Google my family too.
I’m currently testing /e/OS from Murena myself, but on a Fairphone 6, not a Murena device. The system itself is fine. Takes some getting used to, but no problem. Hope you enjoy it =D
Murena is a great alternative. They have relatively cheap and ready-to-use models.
My plan exactly, but on a later schedule - end of the year for me. I’ll go for the cheaper gs6
That is what I intend to get as well. But it would be welcome seing Murena widen their to the entire Gigaset line, like Volla as done.
Well, since I never took time to master phone magic, now they are going to give me a push. Thanks, I guess
I started the journey about a year ago. Huge boon to my life even if I don’t work anywhere near tech.
because many People who loves privacy
almost 12 of us … i jest but seriously, everyone using Apple and >90% of Android users don’t care. Google knows this and they just bang on about this being best for Android users to ameliorate any concerns around governance issues.
Even many supposed staunch, so called privacy advocates, will complain they can’t change because banking or some such, so they stick with the status quo as every minor inconvenience is seen as an insurmountable wall.
So i expect some bloviating initially and then acceptance. In 5 years, no shits given (headphone jack, expandable storage saw the same sort of thing)
tl;dr press x for doubt (x)
You would be surprised. Google privacy practices have a bad press. I’m hearing random people saying they got a "de-googled’ phone at my local hairdresser. Also, the cheapest chinese model are not “Android-certified”, so potentially also de-googled.
How is this going to work for the companies that have internal only apps like time clocks or schedulers. Can they pay the fee and have their apps hidden from the PlayStore or are they all fucked?
Adb will continue to work
This isn’t stopping apps from outside the Play Store, internal apps can still be distributed internally (downloading an APK from a website for example). But these apps now have to be signed by a developer verified by Google. This happens by registering on Google Play, uploading the app, giving Google all the info, and then just not publishing the app on Google Play.
Someone probably going to break the lock like a week into it. You can just refuse the update until it does
Update system,right? Sorry , things what are common for this commun,I am just learning.
Having to jailbreak an android phone… Fuck.
i mean you’ve had to do that from the start if you want to do anything fancy with it
Don’t forget about the new automatic Google play services check that app developers can enable with a single click on build. That automatically blocks the app from working on any degoogled ROM
