I’ve worked 2nd (afternoon), swing (evening), and 3rd (overnight) shifts for the majority of my life. I recently moved into a training position where I’m Monday through Friday, 8am to ~5:30pm (I get OT while I’m cleaning up and writing reports).
As much as the 2nd/swing/3rd shifts screw with your life in other ways, the difficulty in scheduling any kind of life services outside of working hours is maddening. Doctor’s appointment? Nope. DMV? Maybe Saturday, if you’re lucky. Chaperone your kids field trip? Hahahhah no.
I don’t want to burn sick time for a doctor’s appointment (I need to save those for when my kid is actually sick), and I sure as hell don’t want to use up a “vacation” day for it. How tf are you supposed to get anything done?
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Oh I did love swing shift when I was younger. But it was 4 - midnight. Could walk home, and stop for a drink on the way, too. Go home and sleep 8 hours and still not get up too late.
Unfortunately back then I had to have more than one job to survive, but I do like that late-but-not-overnight shift.
We have an “occasional absence” policy where you can take a few hours in the middle of the day for a doctors appointment or such.
My work has this policy too, i just don’t tell anyone when i use it and I’m honest with my hours off the clock to cover my ass if anyone asks.
I don’t get this either. Good fucking luck getting to the bank when you work bank hours.
I have flexible time fortunately, which means I can start later if I have a doctors appointment. I make over hours most of the time so I can use those for these kind of events. Also I reduced my weekly working time to 80%
It’s a privileged situation, but it is the only way to keep me sane. I can go shopping groceries at 3:30 instead of 5 or go to the gym earlier, it makes huge differences.
The job I have now is the first one I’ve had that ever offered flex time. It’s such a treat to be halfway through the day and the boss comes up and goes, “Would you like to leave two hours early?” It’s like being asked if you want free dessert - I have to contain my giddiness, and have yet to say no to the offer.
You’re not supposed to do anything other than generate value. Society doesn’t care about your DMV needs. Just work and consume.
I guess reproduction didn’t make the cut, hence the crashing birth rates.
This. If I take another 1st shift job, I will make sure it’s 10hr shifts with the same week day off weekly.
4-day work weeks are great, especially if you have a significant commute, because you’re cutting 20% of that right out. the adding 2 hours to every work day, not so much; but the longer hours can mean that traffic is a bit lighter. the guaranteed week day off is huge when you have ‘stuff’ to do.
I absolutely hate commuting. If there’s one thing I learned in the spring/summer of 2020, it’s that not driving to work is awesome.
Driving is really fun unless you’re just sitting in traffic, the problem is not getting paid for the time you spend commuting
The people who still had to commute places during that time also learned commuting is not stressful at all when theres barely any people commuting
Almost like theres just too many people expected to commute to work, all at the same damn times
Almost like if there was someway to offset start times and keep as many people WFH as possible, our lives would be 20x better
But no. Fuck you. You show up at the same time as the rest of the city, and you make profits for the overlords just like everyone else, fuck your life and happiness
worst time to commute is 7-9am, and 5pmish.
Truth
A few months ago there was a major leadership change at my job. The guy who was 50% of the interviewers who recommended hiring me is now second from the top and my direct manager (I’m not third from the top, my company’s hierarchy is confusing).
Suddenly, after most of a decade of it never once being a problem, I have been forced from my 4x10 schedule into a standard 5x8. I fucking hate it.
I feel for you. That sucks to have your life thrown into chaos for a decimal number on the balance sheet.
I thought you were saying that the other way around, and was hoping to hear why you like 5x8 more
because yeah, I like 4x10 more. actually, I like having the flexibility to do either one based on how I feel that week and the needs of the company. I like knowing that I can get my 40 hours in and fuck off whenever I want Thursday afternoon for a 3-day weekend, or I can bleed into Friday as much as I want if there are meetings that need to have happen or other work I want to get done by end of week.
I get that some people would prefer 5x8 because they have before or after work obligations, but that’s not me so I would rather have a proper weekend.
So are you hiring?
… generate
valuewealth for the filthy richFTFY
Sometimes it’s using PTO or sick time (normally I’ve been able to take the time in 2 hour blocks), sometimes I’ve just been able to arrange with my supervisor for an extended lunch break, or just taking an unpaid break during the day and making up the hours later in the day or the week so that I’m not hitting my income or not completing my work.
Also, there’s reasons dentist offices often open early, or work on the weekends. Other necessary services like that may offer extended hours on certain days of the week.
EDIT: And things like chaperoning the kid’s field trip? Yeah, you’ll just have to use PTO or not do it. There’s a reason schools usually don’t have many parents volunteer for field trips; most parents can’t get the time off work.
I am sorry you don’t want to burn up sick time or PTO… you have no choice, or find a care giver that works on weekends.
It really sucks.
I spend all my sick days and a non-negligible number of vacation days on the kind of chores you can only get done during work hours. Back when we had “Work From Home”, I would also squeeze these tasks in during my lunch break.
I don’t want to burn sick time for a doctor’s appointment (I need to save those for when my kid is actually sick), and I sure as hell don’t want to use up a “vacation” day for it.
Well, good luck with that. My retired mother-in-law helps a lot with my son when he’s ill. And we can juggle my son between our individual sick-day allotments such that I haven’t run out yet. But yeah, eventually they’re all just “hours to spend that my boss won’t gripe at me for when I use them”. That’s meant dipping into vacation days when I needed to justify not being on the clock.
I’m with you (although I’m Scandinavian, we have better systems in place for sick leave and childcare etc.). I’ve worked afternoons 14-23:30 M-T or nightshift 23:30-6:30 T-F + every other Monday to fill out the hours, almost all my life. Dayshift colleagues ask how I can stand it, but I wonder how they can stand it. If I’m going to the dentist, barber, shopping, or any other errand under the sun, I have no issues getting a time slot within max a couple of days, usually the day after.
Likewise. I hate getting up early.
If it were me, I’d work 10-18, 4x a week instead.
I just tell them I’m gonna be late one day. No PTO necessary.
I’ve had both sides as well, I’ve had jobs where some weeks I worked 7 insanely busy night shifts in a row from 10.30pm to 9.30am. Those weeks you don’t get anything done because you’re just sleeping all day and too tired to do anything after. Not to mention having a commute that was 50 minutes to two hours. That is where I learned I did not want to do that.
And then I also worked 5 days a week working only day shifts 8-6, which bored the shit out of me.
And then I had a much calmer job where officially I worked 8-5, five days a week, but I had to had to figure out how to keep myself busy and I could basically do what I want because my supervisor was fine with whatever because he only cared about the results and I kept those coming. But that was too little structure too.
And I worked part time shift work because that is what was offered at the time and shifts were much shorter and more doable. At that job I had a little too much free time on my hands. I think I just gamed a lot back then. Also not what I wanted.
So now I have something in between, where I do work some weekends, evenings and nights, and I’m compensated during week days, but most of my job is 8-5:30.
And lastly, I want to mention how crazy it is that there is a cap on your sick days. If you get sick, you get sick, right? It’s not really a plannable event, but maybe I’m too European and weak-willed for that.
For some reason, companies in the USA are deathly afraid of someone using sick time when they aren’t actually sick, so they restrict it as tightly as possible. Never mind that this means people are either coming in to work sick, or taking unpaid time off.
Not exclusive to the US. Here in Japan (and I’m sure plenty of places) as well.
that’s the point. the capitalists want every minute of your life they can get to work for them, then make you scramble to fit the rest of your life in the gaps. they make more profit and you have less time and energy to educate yourself, think, and organize
A tired worker is an obedient one
Especially if you have kids. Who’s going to pay for daycare, insurance, day-to-day needs? You basically become a slave to the company cause you don’t have the choice to quit in order to support family
That’s why we need strong communities, solidarity and mutual aid. Get the burden off of individual shoulders and make space to organize.
It’s as easy as asking your neighbours if you wanna take turns cooking dinner for each other or something like that so you have an hour to spare.
I think there was a time, maybe a few decades ago, when it was entirely acceptable and expected for a full time employee to say “I’m taking off early today, I’ve got a few errands to run.” from time to time. I’m very lucky to be able to do that, but it sounds like it’s getting less common.
This is exactly why I’ve stayed working for the same company for the last 6 years. I could definitely go elsewhere and get paid more (job hopping for higher salary is pretty common in my field), but I seriously doubt they’d be as cool with my senior dog’s frequent vet appointments.
I l ove that I call my boss and say i’m running late because my dogs haven’t pooped yet and he’s always cool with it.
Jobs paid enough so one person could stay home is how it worked. Growing up, dad made all the money and mom stayed home to do chores and whatnot. It’s just how things worked. These days mom’s living off of dad’s retirement fund since he died early and she’s always surprised when I have to ask her for money even though its her generation that made the world what it is. Even when I am able to find work my wife and I are check to check. It’s stupid.
Jobs paid enough so one person could stay home is how it worked.
Sure, but you get send your stay-at-home spouse to the doctor or dentist on your behalf. They can manage tasks that are more household than personal though.
Yep we could have kept taxing the wealthy like we did pre Regan and things would have been good still but both parties became neoliberal shit
Eh, except that was only ever true above a certain income level. There has always been a portion of the working class excluded from those perks.
I think the point is that the income level that could afford a stay at home parent used to be way lower than it is today. My parents bought a house in the hood in the 90s for around $100k in their 20s, got by with 3 kids on a single blue collar salary of less than $40k in the 2000s (like ~$70k today), and are doing great financially today. The oldest of us with no kids struggled to buy any home on a double income in specialized skills with degrees. We grew up qualifying for state benefits and pell grants and somehow us kids who are technically “middle class” are doing so much more for less.
Jobs paid enough so one person could stay home is how it worked
That’s a fantasy. In the 1800s and before there was so much at-home work to be done that it was a full time job for someone (virtually always the wife). She had to do the baking, cooking, mending clothes, cleaning, etc. all without any electrical appliances. That included no refrigerator or freezer, so shopping had to be done a lot more often. There were also no cars, so people either had to walk to do their shopping, or they used a horse. But, if they used a horse, then there was extra work related to keeping the horse alive and in good shape. Clothes were also a lot more expensive, so a lot more time was spent either making clothes at home and mending clothes that had holes, worn spots, etc. It wasn’t “to do chores and whatnot”, it was a full-time job involving more work than a typical a typical job from modern days.
Then there was WWI, then the “roaring 20s”, which is when electrical appliances first started appearing, and then the stock market crashed and the great depression hit. During the great depression, if either the wife or the husband could find work, they were lucky, and probably had to support the whole family. During the great depression, a lot of worker protections were put in place through the New Deal. But, the jobs weren’t there.
Then WWII hit, and for a while the US was manufacturing things for the rest of the world without being in the war itself. That helped the economy get going again. When the US joined the war, the economy was really going, but there was rationing in place so the workers who were earning money weren’t able to spend it. When the war ended, the US was in an incredibly strong position. Workers had savings to spend once rationing was removed. Every other country had had its industrial base smashed by the war. As a result, the US manufacturing was in high demand all over the world. For contrast, even though the UK was also one of the “winners” of WWII, rationing was in place until 1954.
So, high demand for industrial workers, worker protections left over from the New Deal era, labour-saving electrical appliances being available for the first time, cars everywhere… it was a unique set of circumstances that meant for maybe the first time in history a man could work a blue collar job and have a wife who stayed at home and just did “chores and whatnot”. That lasted a few decades. People blame Reagan for a lot of it, but really by the time he was elected that golden period for blue collar workers was already ending.
Also, keep in mind that strong protections for workers didn’t just happen. The government didn’t just decide that it would be nice to workers. Workers had to fight hard for those rights. The 8 hour day is the result of fights that were very violent. Bombs were thrown at cops. Supposed ringleaders were hanged by the government after show trials. FDR pushed for laws to protect workers because the alternative was rioting. If today’s workers want to share in the wealth, they need to riot, they need to be prepared to die. Nothing’s going to change if it’s just complaining that “this isn’t how it should be”.
