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USAians are the only Americans who don’t know this.
This fake affront to people from the US calling themselves American is really dumb, man. Yes, everyone from those two hemispheres can be called Americans, but most people don’t have a stronger identity to their super continent than their country. Someone from Columbia isn’t going to call themselves American and then get bothered when they have to clarify that they meant the super continent of North and South America.
People from North America identify as their country first, and North American second, if at all. They don’t call themselves American unless they’re from the states.
You don’t hear people from Italy call themselves Eurasian. And if a new country formed from an alliance of middle eastern countries and called themselves The United Territories of Eurasia, I don’t think any one would bat an eyelash over them calling themselves Eurasian, either. Dumb performative wankery is exhausting, man.
It’s “dumb” because you know I’m right. USAians think they represent everybody on the planet. Every film about aliens has some USAian speaking up on behalf of all humans. Supernatural occurrences only happen in the US. The “World Series” is, you guessed it, in the US.
Also, the French and Spanish literal translation is “USAians”.
And Italians call themselves Italians, but because USAians can’t find the country on a map nor understand that being Italian doesn’t mean you’re in the mob from New York, they have to say European. Sometimes that doesn’t even help.
USAians don’t represent 2 continents, much less the world. Suck it up.
Movies I’m presuming were made in Hollywood largely feature American protagonists? I’m shocked. Don’t writers know they should presume to know other cultures instead? /s
What other languages call Americans is irrelevant. We’re talking in English. Do you think it would be appropriate to call Germans Germans (the English word) in deutsche? Or Japanese people Japanese in their language? Japan, by the way, is actually a translation murdered Chinese name for their people. They refer to themselves as Nihonjin, well 日本人, literally people of the land of the rising sun.
America has always had a xenophobia problem. This means when large groups of immigrants arrive all at once, they’re basically forced to rely on each other because the locals are pretty unfriendly. The result is an immigrant community whose country of origin becomes the thread that kept them all together. The Italians of New England are the Italians because that identity is what saved their community from honestly a really fucked up time. And yeah, the Italian mob also comes from that time period. If you can’t earn money via legitimate means, crime is sometimes the only answer.
We know the difference between Italian Italian and Italian American.
We don’t presume to represent two continents. The policy of our government and the views of the average American are not aligned in that way. Most Americans think we’re the good guys, going out to stop bad guys. Like, actually. Yeah, it’s stupid, but a lot of Americans are waking up to the reality of the situation, now. We’re the most propagandized population on the planet, and it was only during covid that a lot of people saw the mask slip.
What are you on about? What do cultures have to do with this? And USAian protags are regularly cast in different roles (note white-washing). And the “World Series” isn’t just in the movies btw.
We know the difference between Italian Italian and Italian American.
LMAO, sure, whatever you tell yourself to sleep at night. Most of you don’t even know the shape of Italy, let alone the continent it’s on.
We don’t presume to represent two continents.
No no no, of course not. This entire discussion wasn’t you getting pissy about being called USAian. Sorry, completely misread that.
What other languages call Americans is irrelevant.
Where did I say this or imply it? I really hope English isn’t your first language, because you’re doing a pretty bad job at comprehending it.
Also, the French and Spanish literal translation is “USAians”
To quote you, since you want to attack me rather than talk.
I’m not running another gish-gallop with you, man. I’ve said my piece and you’ve been ignoring everything I’m saying, trying to win your troll game. Enjoy, man, and may you have the day you deserve.
I think the English speaking Canadians fall into this trap too. Hopefully they will learn after hosting the world cup 🙏
I’m pretty sure most Americans know everyone else calls it football
The last time I talked to an American they weren’t sure if Canada was part of their country or not. I’m not confident in them being able to understand anything beyond what they can see.
Weirdly, I bet those people know about soccer v football.
soccer is what YOU call it. we didn’t come up with that name, check Wikipedia you ignorant turd.
We call it football. Can’t help that USAians are stuck in the past.
Called it. And what some of us did. You’re right that both names originate in the UK, but soccer was always limited to some dialects and is very rare to hear at all in the UK now
Everyone forgets that soccer is oxford slang for Association Football. So in a weird way, USAians call it football too :/
Soccer is a British word though, but predominantly southerner / Oxfordian.
Association Football used to get contracted to Assoc or Soc to differentiate it from Rugby Football.
And in Oxford, they historically liked to add -er to the end of things; still in parlance today is calling Rugby “rugger”, £5 note “fiver”, the Bodleian Library “Bodder”.
Assoc became “soccer”.
It’s not an American thing. It’s a posh southern England thing that got exported to the states by American students at Oxford returning stateside and bringing the game back with them.
So is it “sock-urh” or “soe’sh-ur”? The latter being like “social” but with an -er ending. Because that’s how ‘association’ is pronounced.
Where is “association” pronounced like that, if I may ask? I could only find the pronunciation I’m familiar with, which is this: https://dictionary.cambridge.org/pronunciation/english/association
To maybe be more clear: you are implying that the c in “soc” is pronounced like a “sh” when it’s the t in “tion”.
(Edit: missed some letters.)
Yeah, that’s how I pronounce ‘association’ as well.
I see now that I said it wrong. The ‘c’ in ‘association’ is pronounced like an ‘s’, so is it ‘so-ser’? Like saying “so-so” but with an -er at the end?
So, if I may ask, how do you pronounce soccer?
To maybe be more clear: you are implying that the c in “soc” is pronounced like a “sh” when it’s the t in “tion”.
Is it not? How do you pronounce it?
Also I’m pretty sure that’s what the “ʃən” at the end of the pronunciation thing means.
Looking at the sound-by-sound pronunciation, it seems to confirm this.
/ʃ/ as in she
/ən/ as in sudden
I think the question was whether or not people pronounce the “soc” in “soccer” the same as they pronounce it in “association” (“soʃ” I guess), or like “sock”
I did provide a link where both the British and the American pronunciation treat the c as an s sound. They have the IPA as /əˌsəʊ.siˈeɪ.ʃən/ for both dialects. “soc” does contain the c, not the t.
As I said, I’m not debating that the t in “tion” is pronounced that way (at least I tried to be clear, maybe I muddled it even more), but I have always pronounced the c as an s sound, and it appears Cambridge agrees with me.
Some British English dialects do use a ʃ sound for the C in “association”. OED has it listed for both UK and USA, though I don’t personally know what the US situation is there
The pronunciation tab there is paywalled, but in the OED app on my phone, they list /əˌsəʊsiˈeɪʃn/, followed by /əˌsəʊʃiˈeɪʃn/ in the pronunciation section. I honestly can’t recall ever hearing a single person in the US pronounce it /əˌsəʊʃiˈeɪʃn/, and though I won’t say nobody does, the other pronunciation is far and away more common, where the ‘c’ and ‘t’ make entirely distinct sounds.
Counterintuitively it’s “sock-urh”.
Yet there is not a single British person who calls it soccer.
This isn’t a strong argument; Brits mangle the language every time they open their mouths.
It’s not just Brits, literally the whole world calls it football except for one country which thinks it is right and everyone else is wrong.
So, what you’re saying is the majority of first-language English speakers call it soccer?
Also, show some fucking respect to Canada.
I watched several documentaries over the years that said it is because at the time Football Clubs were referred to as Social Clubs and the team was just part of the Social Club. The clubs were referred to as “Socs” pronounced like the footwear Socks, and the Teams would play what was referred to a s “Soccer” as in Sock-er. Then this got exported to various people in North America, mostly from the South and West of England. Then it fell out of usage in England but no one told us over here in North America so we kept using the term.
It’s not just to distinguish it from rugby football. There are dozens of different types of games of football. Association football is just the one that got particularly popular across the world.
Cool origin. Still an US thing if only people from the US do it.
“The origin is British so it’s your fault we do it” sounds like “mom didn’t educate me so it’s her fault I’m a deadbeat - 40y.o. adult”.
You are allowed to improve your language.
So it should be pronounced like so-ser?
In Scotland, yes.
IDK why we changed it from Gridiron. That shit sounds way cooler.
Frankly, all of the different football games should get a proper name like that. Gridiron and rugby (both union and league) are both great names. You can call them gridiron football or rugby football if you want to be formal. Soccer is basically the same idea, being a shortening of association football. Now we just need counterparts for Australian and Gaelic
Blame the British, Oxford specifically, and their penchant to name things ending in -er. They’re the ones that named it, and they hide from that fact now as if they were never a part of it.
https://www.history.com/articles/why-do-some-people-call-it-soccer
Blame the British, Oxford specifically, and their penchant to name things ending in -er
You could call them a tosser for what they’ve done but you’ll be playing right into their hand
They call their game American football and then they carry the ball in hands for like 99% of the time…
They actually just call it football
In Canada we call “ice hockey” “hockey” and the former manages to irritate me every time, even though I don’t actually care at all about hockey.
I get that. It’s like calling it “Old Mexico” because New Mexico exists. Nah man, it’s just Mexico
Most version of football are actually carried by hand. Rugby league, Rugby Union, Gridiron, Gaelic, Australian and International, all allow carrying the ball. Soccer is actually the black sheep of the football family.
It’s only soccer if they forget to wear their boots
I barely know her
Football just means a game played on foot, as opposed to on horse.
I don’t think so… basically that would mean every sport could/should be called “football”…
-
Basketball = played on foot, not horse therefore football
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Volleyball = played on foot, not horse therefore football
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Baseball = no horse, football again
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Hockey = believe it or not, football… maybe skate ball?
I am kidding of course, it seems nobody really knows and the 2 main theories are the one you mentioned (on foot, not on horse) vs kicking of a ball with your foot (and not your hand)
Don’t forget golf
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The arrow is pointing to his shin though?
Good Ole shinball
It’s almost like arrows point… in a direction. You may find in your life that arrows are indicating toward things that are not directly touching the end.
¿Por qué no los dos? Personally tired of these primarily online binary semantic arguments. Gif, jif, football, soccer, fútbol, pineapple, ananas, eggplant, aubergine. We contain multitudes, celebrate these absolutely arbitrary differences.
“When you go to the pearly gates, call them 'Jod ’ and see how it works out for you” was my favourite response to the gif/jif debate.
(Oddly enough Jif is an abrasive bathroom cleaner / was a lemon juice brand where I’m from (or vice versa) it was renamed to Cif to stop people from suing the companies because they added cream cleaner to their lemon meringue pie)
Obviously, It’s pronounced ‘Jif’ like in ‘Jorge’
Jif is my jod.
Jif you say so
No.
Them other folks need to learn themselves to talk proper.
Both the American and rest of the world versions of their respective ball games are played on foot, as opposed to polo that is played riding a horse. The latter was originally invented by Ralph Lauren, as commemorated in ubiquitous t-shirts with a gentlemanly collar.
Why do people still wear Lacoste if no one plays gatorball anymore?
Speak for yourself, I’ve been handcrafting the only gatorballs strong enough to survive their bite strength for years!
I thought it was an anthropomorphous pickle!
Actually I believe it’s called “Football” because most ball games were originally played on horseback.
Football (Soccer) was one of the first ball games to be played on foot, hence Foot-ball
That’s why Rugby, Canadian Football, Australian Football, and American Football are also types of “Football”.
Also, the name “Soccer” was literally invented in England. It’s short for “Association Football” (Association - Assoc - Soccer) so shut the f*** up
Man, Baseball with horses would be wild.
BaseballfootbatIn Australian AFL, otherwise known as Aussie Rules, it’s pretty common to need to jump high enough that you get another person to launch you. Imagine that from horseback! I’d watch.
That’s basically extreme polo isn’t it?
Ten Pin Bowling, on horseback.
Actually I believe it’s called “Football” because most ball games were originally played on horseback.
hmmm are you sure about that? I do not know with certainty but today playing a sport with a horse would be a high demand, back in the days it would have been an even bigger one so I sincerely doubt “most ball games” were originally played on horseback when not having a horse was that much easier
That’s like saying “we call them Earthmobiles because back then, most vehicles were just planes” (no way planes were common before cars)
You are sort of right regarding the origin of soccer, but it was intended to distinguish football played by the association rules vs other types of football which were popular at the time.
From Wikipedia:
Association football is part of a family of football codes that emerged from various ball games played worldwide since antiquity. The word “association” in this term refers to the Football Association (the FA), founded in London in 1863, which published the first set of rules for the sport that same year.[8] The term was coined to distinguish the type of football played in accordance with the FA rules from other types that were gaining popularity at the time, particularly rugby football.[9] Heading from The Sportsman front page of 25 November 1910, illustrating the continued use of the word “football” to encompass both rugby and association football.
The term soccer comes from Oxford “-er” slang, which was prevalent at the University of Oxford in England from about 1875, and is thought to have been borrowed from the slang of Rugby School. Initially spelt assoccer (a shortening of “association”), it was later reduced to the modern spelling.[10][11] Early alternative spellings included socca and socker.[9] This form of slang also gave rise to rugger for rugby football, fiver and tenner for five pound and ten pound notes, and the now-archaic footer that was also a name for association football.[12]
Within the English-speaking world, association football is now usually called simply “football” in Great Britain and most of Ulster in the north of Ireland,[13] whereas people usually call it “soccer” in regions and countries where other codes of football are prevalent, such as Australia,[14] Canada, South Africa, most of Ireland (excluding Ulster),[15] and the United States. A notable exception is New Zealand, where in the first two decades of the 21st century, under the influence of international television, “football” has been gaining prevalence, despite the dominance of other codes of football, namely rugby union and rugby league.[16]
Umm… ever heard of Polo? Buzkashi? Chovgan? Pato? All of those are ball games played on horseback (except Buzkashi which is played on horseback but uses a a goat carcass instead of a ball)
Your analogy is also false because cars were invented before planes.
1885–1886: Benz Patent-Motorwagen becomes the first practical automobile.
1903: Orville Wright and Wilbur Wright achieve the first powered, controlled airplane flight with the Wright Flyer.
(except Buzkashi which is played on horseback but uses a a goat carcass instead of a ball)
wait…what?
Yes, you read that correctly…
A decapitated, disemboweled goat is surprisingly hard to tear apart. The hide and connective tissue can withstand dozens of riders yanking it around at full gallop.
Are you telling me a goat ball is the GOAT of balls?
Yes, I suppose that is what i’m saying
Umm… ever heard of Polo? Buzkashi? Chovgan? Pato? All of those are ball games played on horseback (except Buzkashi which is played on horseback but uses a a goat carcass instead of a ball)
Your analogy is also false because cars were invented before planes.
That was exactly my point… do you think nobody thought of kicking a ball around BEFORE they decided to break horses, train them and then push a ball around with a stick while on horseback?
To risk a valuable commodity as a horse in a game, it implies humanity was already well off enough (at least some people) to keep horses around with relative ease
My point was that the simplest form of a sport (on foot) would have likely existed (and indeed they did) WAAAAAAYYYYY before we decided to play sports on horses
At the end of the day, it seems both sources are valid: Horseback sports were the only ones officially recognized during medieval times; AS WELL AS, historical records showing games played by kicking balls from way before. Which of those 2 sources or both to a certain extent are part of the etymology of the modern word “football”
Sure, but the term Football wasn’t coined when ball games were invented. It was coined much later when there were already lots of different sports.
Among the sports people people played at the time, Football was one where the participants are on foot.
Most sports were played (and still are) on foot
Look I get your point but neither my original theory (foot = kicking) or yours (foot = not on horse) have been proven to be the “real” source of the word football today; maybe it’s one or the other OR influenced by both sources
do you think nobody thought of kicking a ball around BEFORE they decided to break horses
of course they did, but why would a self respecting elite adopt peasant terminology for a beloved pass time? How could it get away with skewing early rules and standards if they couldb’t frame it entirely as theur own? How could they exclusively commodify it if it were not mythologized as their own creation?
Of course these point are vastly irrelevant to the discussion at hand but, make no mistake, i’d never have made them if they were to begin with.
Yes it was called football because the peasants played it on their feet while the nobles played polo and other equestrian sports. There’s a huge documented history, several Kings in English history all had a take on the issue. Some thought it was awful because they hated seeing their peasants creating a spectacle and sometimes they got hurt and couldn’t work, but other kings leaned into it and used it to gain favor with the lower classes.
According to wikipedia, what you claim is true but also there is documented history of the “foot” part coming up because of the kicking of the ball from really far back
The truth is we do not seem to know which of the 2 sources truly directed the current name… very likely both contributed
That doesn’t make sense because most forms of football (rugby and american etc) use mostly the hands to carry the ball. The name was never about kicking, it was about playing on foot, until John Cleese made a joke about it. There’s sources going back to the middle ages about it.
The word “football” precedes all those modern sports you are referring to.
As I said, from the wikipedia article, it seems there is a bit of both
if it’s called football, then why did YOU name it soccer? seems kind of silly to blame other people for using the name you insisted everyone use.
but that’s like imperial measurements, you insisted everyone use them and then changed your mind down the line and now make fun of us for using the Imperial system that Imperial Britian came up with. you have a nasty habit of blaming everyone else for the problems you create.
The freaking English named it soccer to distinguish from rugby football and brought that name here!
And you haven’t evolved since then?
I’m relatively confident that Lady Butterfly was not involved in either of these things you’re accusing her of.
Soccer aka association football is just one out of many rulesets for football
British imperial units and US customary units were actually both codified after American independence! Both British imperial and US customary units are derived from earlier English customary units. We made some agreements to harmonise our two systems over time so that we were at least using the same pound and yard, because we weren’t before, but somehow volume units escaped this
Ironically we did sort of hamper your early efforts at metrication completely unintentionally; British pirates (privateers, more accurately) captured the French ship that happened to be carrying standards for the metric system across the Atlantic to you
Either way, Brits definitely shouldn’t make fun of anyone for their system of measurement, because the only thing worse than a non-metric system is using some cursed half-and-half Frankenstein mashup of both metric and non-metric
The full name is Association Football with Soccer being appropriate the Oxford vernacular abbreviation.
ankle ball
