And a more reliable product that returns the expected results every time.
So does children working in Palestinian brick furnaces, this argument makes no sense.
So you support eating kittens is that it!!1?
Proprietary frontier LLMs in companies riddled with highly suspect business practices.
My local LLM setup has absolutely been making the equivalence of positive cashflow for me since gemma 4 and qwen 3.8: I need less total time for several groups of annoying (but necessary) tasks, which means my productivity is up and I can use the rest as my own free time.
I need less total time for several groups of annoying (but necessary) tasks
Such as? Just curious what people use LLMs for.
I handle so many text files in my job and LLMs help make the scripts for me to handle these text files. I know it is important to at least know stuff like regex but I am not a superhuman. It is difficult for me to heavily specialize in scripting while also specialize in the technicalities of my job. To help show why it is difficult to specialize scripting, I work with hardware description languages which have a different syntax from scripting languages. Handling different languages causes confusion on the proper syntax even with a basic if else statement because the syntax is different between languages.
Aside from this, it can also help me automate describing what the sequences I created in the file for easy documentation. I just have to instruct the “patterns” it needs to look for. I just need to proofread the output and do minor fixes.
- Answer questions (with references) about source code and documentation
- Add clear-bounded features to a pre-existing codebase
- Transpile between programming languages
Stuff I can do myself perfectly well, but the results - after postprocessing - are indistinguishable from me having done so. Even when accounting for everything (including hallucinations) the time savings are real: Renewables-powered electricity is cheaper than my attention. By a lot.
Caveat: This only works if you’re already a domain expert and if you do it exclusively for too long, you might be at risk of ceasing to be such an expert. Don’t use it to try and do the thinking for you.
If AI could really make your business so much more efficient that it makes up for the cost of paying for AI… Why doesn’t Google just run your business themselves? They could make even more money than you do.
Theyd probably try to use gemini, and it would either spin in circles or delete their production databases
“I remember once my father and I were walking down Fifth Avenue and there was a homeless person sitting right outside of Trump Tower and I remember my father pointing to him and saying, ‘You know, that guy has $8 billion more than me,’ because he was in such extreme debt at that point, you know?”
~ Ivanka Trump
I refuse to believe that Trump is capable of such introspection.
Believe it or not, Trump’s become dumber with age.
While I believe he is dumber, he has slid further down from a room temp IQ.
They could if investors were happy with good enough and didn’t need to release a mediocre update every 8 weeks. Plenty of folks would be happy with opus 4.8 for the next few years and a $20 a month sub.
You seem to misunderstand “opus 4.8 and $20 a month” IS the reason why they are unprofitable.
They already got the data and GPUs and lots of researchers doing research. In fact, since gpt-4o they have been trying to make these models smaller and more profitable.
But at the present moment, they just can’t beat chinese models on efficiency cuz that’s what those companies were focusing on from the begining due to gpu export law US put.
The Chinese models were also developed later and allegedly didn’t have to focus so hard on the initial acquisition of training data, so were able to build their models completely differently.
Think of it like developing dictionary technology. For the first dictionary, the hardest part is finding all the words that need to be defined. After that it’s just a matter of adding new words occasionally as they’re found.
That’s the “theft” the Western AI companies accused the Chinese companies of doing. By starting with the initial training data from Western devs, the Chinese AIs (allegedly) skipped over the hard part, which means they are able to focus more of their processing on the end product.
And that’s not necessarily a bad thing, depending on your perspective (ignoring all the ethical questions around AI data acquisition). Duplicating work someone else has already done is wasteful.
But it’s also disingenuous to say that the guy who takes an existing dictionary and changes all the definitions did a “better job” than the guy who wrote the first one, even if the end product is, in fact, better.
at this rate Winamp might get more profitable than OpenAI and it is free.
But isn’t OpenAI just burning billions of moneys already? In that case Winamp is already more profitable
Your local grocery store is more profitable than OpenAI. In fact you are more profitable than OpenAI.
OpenAI owes hundreds of billions of dollars, with a revenue a fraction of that. They will never become profitable.
The Weimar Republic was more profitable… well no, maybe not. But you get the sentiment.
I mean, you joke. But Germany pivoted out of the Great Depression far faster than its European peers precisely because they weren’t afraid to print a bunch of money and pay people to do things.
The Fascists inherited one of the only recovering economies in Europe by the time they took power in 1932. And when they assumed office, they brought investment from the Americans overseas (who were having their own fascist turn), because they were willing to purge or enslave local populations, tear down neighborhoods, and build up whatever capital Standard Oil, IBM, and Ford Motor Company asked of them.
On the opposite side of the Atlantic and on the other side of the Urals, progressive liberals and Soviet communists were trying out a leftist mirror of this strategy. They were using the levers of the state to mobilize the masses of unemployed labor into productive capital improvements for the benefit of the public at-large. So the US, Germany, Japan, and the USSR all rapidly emerged out of the '29 crash into a booming 1930s economy. Meanwhile, England and France and much of Latin America and North Africa languished under artificial constraints of state-capitalism.
Why does that feel forebodingly familiar
I mean, we’ll jump to 1930s on reflex. But this is a pattern that’s repeated itself internationally, from Apartheid South Africa to the juntas in the Pacific Rim to Fascists in Argentina and Chile.
Economy shits itself. Social Democrats come in to deliver milquetoast reforms. The economy recovers somewhat, but never enough to actually relieve the social pressures of the moment. And then the democratic system starts vomiting up radical candidates of all stripes, while bourgeois capital attempts to ride the tiger into the next full recovery and/or national emergency.
The wheel of fortune doesn’t always land on Fascism. But it’s definitely a possibility.
History doesn’t repeat, but it rhymes.
It seems like we’re plunging into fascism, but maybe this upcoming midterms will (not be rigged and) prove to be an effective backlash to the US’ reactionary coup. What do you figure the odds are we pull out of this and say, “huh actually let’s try that FDR thing instead of this Nazi shit”?
Considering the overwhelming support among Democratic politicians and party insiders for fascist collaboration, the odds are probably low.
They made trillions of marks, so yes they were extremely profitable.
I like that they never lost their gusto with the designs of the bills lol
Like they had to know that their currency was basically dead, yet they still made sure that those 100 billion Mark notes looked classy as fuck.
If/when the modern US makes it to this point, I can’t imagine them putting all that much effort into making our $100 billion dollar bills look cool.
They’ll probably have fucking Steve Bannon’s face on them.
The person designing them had to make them pretty because they knew they were going to be paid in them
Like they had to know that their currency was basically dead, yet they still made sure that those 100 billion Mark notes looked classy as fuck.
you are more profitable than OpenAI
I’ve got mortgage debt though.
See, you’d think people would do more research when lending billions for LLMs than when lending a dollar for a cardboard box.
They’re hoping it pays off in the long run, or at least long enough for them to go public and sell their shares at a profit while pension funds and mutual funds buy a crashing asset.
you won’t generate a 1,000x return on investment, AI could if it becomes AGI somehow. It’s like gambling but nobody knows the odds and the payout is big enough that it’s almost worth it to try without knowing the odds.
I’ve been familiar with the Singularity for a long time now and this “recent” perspective by AI investors bewilders me. There’s no profit to be had there - you can’t enslave a god. 💀
they don’t know that
Waaaaaay less than OpwnAI though
They will never become profitable.
If you look at OpenAI as a single, independent, private company then they appear unprofitable. But when you look at them as a means of laundering Pentagon money and other federal contracts into straw purchases for NVIDIA and Oracle, they are immensely profitable.
AI is a Loss Leader. It props up the production and sale of hardware, which has been enormously profitable for its partners, its investors, and the economy as a whole. It is a digital form of induced demand in so far as new construction creates a “virtuous” cycle of increasing consumption, as more and more of the business and public sector is dragged into its orbit.
The end-game for OpenAI is to have a captured market of businesses and government institutions. Whole sectors of the economy devoid of human knowledge workers who are hopelessly addicted to AI Agent processes, because nobody managing the companies actually know what these agents are doing anymore. At this point, Altman and Amodei can charge whatever they damned well please for token traffic, because there’s no bureaucracy capable of competing with them.
Most of the money getting funneled to Nvidia came from them in the first place. That’s why they’re one of the chatbot’s biggest cheerleaders.
Most of the money getting funneled to Nvidia came from them in the first place.
NVIDIA’s not getting most of its money from OpenAI. OpenAI doesn’t really buy anything from NVIDIA. They buy rack space from Oracle, which then builds out new datacenters with NVIDIA chipsets. And Oracle’s primary revenue stream is from its business Cloud Services, of which OpenAI is a small fraction.
This would make sense if they were the only game in town , but they very much…aren’t.
Keeping foreign technology out of the reach of US consumers has been a big part of Trump/Biden/Trump-Era tech policy.
And as hardware prices skyrocket, access to compute approaches a monopoly position.
Tech companies are expected to be run at a loss for quite some time before they start being profitable.
They were founded in 2015 and “officially” launched GPT in 2022 to the public. If they make profits by 2032, that would be in line with how other tech companies established themselves.
For example, Spotify wasn’t profitable until 2024. They launched in 2008.
So, I don’t know why them not being profitable is what everyone is talking about. They’re not expected to be profitable until 2030 at the earliest. And every serious investor know this.
Yes I’m very fun at parties. But it seems that a lot of people just do not understand the expected timelines of tech companies.
They have to at least have a plausible path to profitability. The serious investors have known for some time there isn’t one with AI. Just because the AI companies will never be profitable long term doesn’t mean there is no reason to invest in them short term. That’s what a speculative bubble is. Everyone believes the line will keep going up long enough for them to turn around and sell to a greater fool in the near future. And for the most part they’re right. The ultimate bag-holder ends up being the middle class worker and their auto-assigned 401k portfolio.
Okay but the world had enough money to bankroll Spotify for 20 years. It doesn’t have the kind of money OpenAI needs.
And Spotify was barely making a loss AND had a lot of revenue. They were just putting more capital into infrastructure, etc. instead of profits.
at this point a granny selling eggs is more profitable
At this point Stinky Whizzleteets teaching my grandmother to suck eggs (on OnlyGrans) is more profitable.
I wonder what will happen in 2027 when those repayments come due.
The government will buy a stake to both pay billionaires more from collected taxes and control what information can be generated and making the spy apparatus backdoors tracking every question or command part of the official platforms.
I’ll bet you $$$ right now that won’t happen. First of all, they still won’t be profitable. Second of all it’s easy to just completely avoid interacting with LLMs.
it’s easy to just completely avoid interacting with LLMs.
I wish that were true. Have you seen reddit lately? Lemmy isn’t immune but I haven’t encountered any obvious bot posts here yet.
I don’t fucking use reddit. You seem to be missing the point.
Squeeze the working class.
That won’t pay off the several hundred billion they owe.
That’s for governments to figure out.
They will get an extension based on lies about ai genocide or something.
They’ll pay off the old loans with new loans disguised as investments between all the major AI players.
The government will bail them out: “Too big to fail”
My crooked spotted cock is more profitable than OpenAI
I was finally starting to save up money in a 401k for retirement. Then I got fired. Now the AI bubble is going to burst and nuke what little money is in my 401k. FML.
You should roll over your 401K to investments you believe in.
I’m trying to stick with it, and not pull a bunch of money out. If this is all just insider trading back and forth, my hope is it will recover over time and level out. (As that will be in the interest of the manipulators too.)
If it’s just a big crash, like 1929 style, then I figure we’re all fucked whether you have stocks or dollar bills or CDs or doubloons.
As that will be in the interest of the manipulators too.
Nope, crashes are when they buy the poors assets at cents on the dollar.
Until it’s bad enough that the poors decide they have had it with the owner class,
Some of the big S&P500 ETFs (like VOO) have shockingly little exposure to AI relative to the rest of the market
Source? Interested
https://www.bogleheads.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=472817
Also somewhat relevant: https://beatthecouch.com/
“Source: AI” is kinda wild for this purpose
I don’t understand your comment - bogleheads is a forum of real people? I included a silly example illustrative of my point, but the forum is decidedly not AI. Did you miss the first link, which was the point of my comment?
The first post in that thread had a guy using AI to figure out how much of his portfolio was in AI.
How do forums work?
Literally the first sentence of the post you linked to says:
I asked AI for advice on how to reduce our risk of the various AI stocks in our portfolio
Couldn’t make it past the first comment, or are forums a new thing for you?
Yes that’s how the thread started - what else did you learn?
So you’re saying we should be pumping all our savings and pension money in WinRar?
It has more potential.
If they can get their sales into double digits, the sky’s the limit!
Those numbers may actually kill the CEO.
I’m one of the seeming few who paid to register it back in the Win9x days. Turned out that the key also works for the non-free Linux version (think I only ever bothered to set that up once). These days gzipped tarballs or squashfs with zstd are my go-tos. The former for speed with source trees or such, and the latter for filesystem backups or larger directories, because loop mounting it is so fast and convenient.
The former for speed with source trees or such
xz -0is faster than gzip and has a higher compression ratio.That can’t be right, all reports I have read about comparing xz with gzip tells me that xz will have better compression but at a slower speed than gzip.
Have you run a test of gzip at the same compression level with the same data?
I don’t doubt that xz will be smaller, I doubt it will be quicker.
These days gzipped tarballs or squashfs with zstd are my go-tos.
What the fuck did you just call me?
git gudyour mom gave me zstd in my tarballs
And Jia Tan xz’d in your back door?
Actually, I’m pretty sure WeWork was more profitable than OpenAI, both in absolute dollars and percentage.
.jpg)
